Gentoo Websites Logo
Go to: Gentoo Home Documentation Forums Lists Bugs Planet Store Wiki Get Gentoo!
Bug 4650 - telnetd not as core-package
Summary: telnetd not as core-package
Status: RESOLVED FIXED
Alias: None
Product: Portage Development
Classification: Unclassified
Component: Unclassified (show other bugs)
Hardware: x86 Linux
: High normal (vote)
Assignee: Martin Schlemmer (RETIRED)
URL:
Whiteboard:
Keywords:
: 4834 (view as bug list)
Depends on:
Blocks: 4875
  Show dependency tree
 
Reported: 2002-07-07 13:51 UTC by Philipp Morger
Modified: 2011-10-30 22:19 UTC (History)
2 users (show)

See Also:
Package list:
Runtime testing required: ---


Attachments

Note You need to log in before you can comment on or make changes to this bug.
Description Philipp Morger 2002-07-07 13:51:05 UTC
Dear "packages"-file manager

is there any reason why telnetd is a core-package?
if so, please  enlighten me.... otherwise I request to remove it... 

thanks
phil
Comment 1 Spider (RETIRED) gentoo-dev 2002-07-07 14:29:29 UTC
well, this is the package that contains "telnet" something that is quite
indisposable in any operating system, mainly because of its uses as a debugging
tool, not as a remote-login tool

just my 2c
Comment 2 SpanKY gentoo-dev 2002-07-07 16:36:53 UTC
i agree with spider ... i use telnet as a quick 'connect to this host on this 
port' rather than as a remote login tool 
 
plus, telnet is pretty much a 'standard' on all unix/linux distro's ... there 
are very few cmds you can really expect to have on every unix/linux install 
out there, telnet is one ;) 
Comment 3 Philipp Morger 2002-07-07 16:48:47 UTC
well, i didn't realized, that the server + client are in one package.... sorry,
I'm a little but used to debian..... so the new question is: can the server and
client part be splitted? or is it inpossible to compile a client without the server?

anyway, I still vote for leaving it outside of the core-packge.... cos ssh is
also not in the core - not that I want ssh in the core.... it just cleaner....
so people who want to make a real small system still have the chance without
"patching" the packages tree.... 
Comment 4 SpanKY gentoo-dev 2002-07-07 16:54:28 UTC
well, following the lines of a real small system (im making 1 atm to fit on a 
300 meg hd and be able to run X ;]), i think its more of a user's initiative to 
do `emerge system -p` then pic out the pkg's that he truly needs rather then 
playing with the portage tree 
in this case, dont pick telnetd ;) 
Comment 5 Philipp Morger 2002-07-10 06:17:40 UTC
so you agree... it's easier to add something to the system than to have it left
out....
Comment 6 SpanKY gentoo-dev 2002-07-10 08:32:02 UTC
regardless, i believe it should be part of the core system
if your only argument as to why it shouldnt be is space saving, then i'd point 
out that telnetd takes up 32k ... on some systems, thats 1 block ... you'd be 
saving more space if you deleted two 1 byte files out of /etc/
Comment 7 Philipp Morger 2002-07-10 14:47:27 UTC
well, this is true for the binary.... but there are other files (the package,
and maybe some others :) - but no, space is not the top priority that I care of.
Because you are right - if you are not about to make "Gentoo on Floppy" you
don't really care about it.

My other points are: 

-non-bloated core-system
-maybe people don't want telnet on the box for security reasons -> so they need
a non-bloated system
-a package less to compile, yeah on a P4 2,533 GHz it takes 0.nothing seconds....
-people who want it have to add it once in their system-livetime, those wo don't
want it have to remove it every time.
-tcpdump, I need this tool all the time, is it in the core-package?
-ssh, Is there another remote login tool? Is it in the core-system?
-the crypto-kernel, I guess one of the coolest packages I found so far in
gentoo, why isn't it in the core-system
-ntp, what it a clock for if it's not accurate? is it in the core-system?

my point is: if you belive telnet should be in the core, than I say that
tcpdump, ssh, ntp are at least also part of the "core", maybe it's gentoo's aim
to provide a core-system which is fully prepared for network operations - like
an OpenBSD, where Apache and SSH are installed by default.

Due to the fact, that gentoo inherited some parts of the
"linux-from-scratch"-spirit, I though that minimalistic is just also part of the
spirit.
Comment 8 Martin Schlemmer (RETIRED) gentoo-dev 2002-07-10 17:29:17 UTC
Blah, nearly read the bug wrong way round :P

I tend to agree with phil about this, as it goes into the same catagory
as the reiserfs tools, which I *really* hate to have installed on all
my boxes (especially after I lost a *lot* of data to reiserfs early in
2000 ... given, it could have been on any fs [really ? :P] ).

Then on second thoughs ... it was prob added because in the beginning we
were without "emerge -s foo" aka the search functionality.  And in those
days, you rather added something to core, rather than having to have the
same bug report every few weeks (well, not that bad ;-) ).  Sorda same
as the gnome depend to gdk-pixbuf.

So ... base should be just that ... BASE.  Should we just yank the telnet*
package.  Not sure ... I am not 100% sure about my reason above *g*.  Maybe
we should check with Daniel if he can remember other issues.  In general it
could be nice to have a leaner base .. some of us still have pentiums with
500mb hdd's we want to fit things on.

Not sure how to go about it ... maybe have like profiles, a setting
(BASE="lean|net|foo" ) that controlls the "type" of base system the
user have .. maybe this is complication things too much.  Maybe just have
the required things for most base builds to base ?

Ok, enouth confusion added, Ill go to bed now :P

Comment 9 Grant Goodyear (RETIRED) gentoo-dev 2002-07-11 12:57:02 UTC
*** Bug 4834 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
Comment 10 Grant Goodyear (RETIRED) gentoo-dev 2002-07-11 13:04:33 UTC
Actually, openssh has been in every default system that I've installed
during the last year and a half or so.
Comment 11 Philipp Morger 2002-07-30 03:39:12 UTC
a small addition of the same topic

nano should be virtual - so users who install joe or vi(m) are not forced to
have a second editor...

further I noticed that logrotate is not in the "core-package" which I would
consider as a "core-element" also the "gentoo-toolkit" might be a "core-element"