Hi, all. I know, this is anoying, but I noticed that recently the gentoo-sources builds seem to not recieve a version bump when changes or bugfixes are applied to them. In my case, the gentoo-sources-r7 ebuild has changed in several ways since -r7 was released, but I wouldn't have known had I not checked the ChangeLog. Is this by design? Shouldn't a revision, once released, stay the same, and new gentoo-side bugfixes or patches bump up the revision number? This becomes especially important if I am to be able to bugfix different machines with the same hardware configurations, but which have been built at different times. In this example, if they have different kernel patchsets, then tracking down bugs ("But it's the same $#^$@# kernel!") is made into a major hair-pulling exercise. And I need all the hair I can get. ;) Thanks for your work. Apologies if this is inappropriately categorized.
Yes, but we don't think that making 7 or so revisions of gentoo-sources is a good idea. With a large proportion of Gentoo users being "upgrade-crazy", I think this might be a bad idea, especially when they start recompiling kernels which they don't particularly need to and then we get flamed for changing revisions all the time...
I share Jesse's point of view. What does a system like portage help, if not every change in an ebuild, that causes compilation or configuration changes, results in a new revision. This affects not only gentoo-sources, but all ebuilds/developers. In Bug 31074, Spanky noted something about policies; A lot of developers seem to don't know about them. A good example is xfree. xfree-4.3.0-r3 was declared stable on 06 Oct - have a look, how much changes were made, whitout raising the revision number. plasmaroo: Yes you're right that compiling for nothing isn't nice. On the other hand, one could argue, that the ebuilds are not well tested, if stable ebuilds get changed all the time. I really don't have a problem to read the changelog of unstable ebuilds I use, occasionally. But I expect to be informed of changes in ebuilds, if they're marked stable. Having an eye on every single ebuild isn't possible, so how do I get this information!? Imho, raising the revision number is the way to go. I mean - it's still the decision of the machine owner, if he does emerge -u world or emerge -pulv some_ebuild and handling ebuilds/masks to his liking.
Carlo: changes such as in XFree 4.3.0-r2 to -r3 are major. I would qualify that as a bump. If you look at the kernel ebuilds however, in ViewCVS, you'd notice that there are only small patches which only affect a small userset. The reason we bumped gentoo-sources to -r7 was because we added a large major change, the GCC 3.3 patches, so we wouldn't get showered with bug reports. Things like fixing small *synthetic* components because of side-effects from grsecurity are not major: somebody would get really annoyed if they have to remerge their gentoo-sources every day or two! >> On the other hand, one could argue, that the ebuilds are not well tested, if >> stable ebuilds get changed all the time. Patches we commit *are* tested, and as they're C code, we can see what changes what and what works/fails. Unless we're backporting patches, there's not much else to test after they've been commited to CVS and approved by us. >> Having an eye on every single ebuild isn't possible, so how do I get this >> information!? May I suggest the GWN or the daily CVS ChangeLog page?
>Carlo: changes such as in XFree 4.3.0-r2 to -r3 are major. I meant the changes from declaring -r3 stable up to now. If the binaries, a stable ebuild "produces", change, it is a major change imho. > Patches we commit *are* tested, ... Sure - I expect nothing else. ;-) Please don't get me wrong - I wanted to attract your attention. I never had real big problems with kernel ebuilds, but with other ones, until I found out, how restrictive revisions are handled. > May I suggest the GWN or the daily CVS ChangeLog page? No - i usually don't get there information about ebuild changes that don't result in a new revision number and if I get a hint, I still have to look at the changelog. One great idea in Gentoo is Portage as a central tool to install source based software. I mean - why should i search for changes (if I had the time), if the system could present it in an easy and uncomplicated way?
Just bumped.
Thank you! Sorry for the trouble.
