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Bug 349738 - ebuild request: Precompiled Debian kernel in gentoo.
Summary: ebuild request: Precompiled Debian kernel in gentoo.
Status: RESOLVED WONTFIX
Alias: None
Product: Gentoo Linux
Classification: Unclassified
Component: New packages (show other bugs)
Hardware: All Linux
: High enhancement (vote)
Assignee: Default Assignee for New Packages
URL:
Whiteboard:
Keywords:
Depends on:
Blocks:
 
Reported: 2010-12-26 08:59 UTC by dE
Modified: 2013-03-02 16:43 UTC (History)
2 users (show)

See Also:
Package list:
Runtime testing required: ---


Attachments
Sorry for the bad quality. If I improve it, I will volenteer to mainain these sources. (debian-sources-2.6.32.ebuild,1.33 KB, text/plain)
2010-12-31 06:35 UTC, dE
Details

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Description dE 2010-12-26 08:59:13 UTC
Many times genkernel does not produce a proper kernel that can boot, many times the configuration is not right. When you build your own kernel you might miss out on a few important things which results in low performance, instability, insecurity etc... etc.. etc...

Thus for comparison purposes and at times for ease it's a good idea to try out other precompiled kernels from other distros, just to see if a problem lies in the kernel or userspace.

This single ebuild will include the kernel from other distro + the modules.

Reproducible: Always

Steps to Reproduce:
Comment 1 Panagiotis Christopoulos (RETIRED) gentoo-dev 2010-12-26 09:42:15 UTC
For the years I remember, the "gentoo way" is, users, to build their own kernel on their own (either using genkernel or pure/patched sources). Theoritically if someone wants to take a working configuration, he/she can use the kernel configuration of our livecds. Yes, I know that sometimes building your own kernel is frustrating (especially if someone is not an experienced linux/gentoo user) but using a debian kernel won't be a panacea in such cases. I'm also afraid that even an attempt to make an ebuild won't be as easy as you might think. The user will also have again to find which modules to probe for his/her hardware which isn't much different from building his/her own kernel. Last but not least, what every distro offers at the end is the "linux kernel", the difference is that our kernel comes with do-it-yourself instructions. I would resolve this as CANTFIX but it's not my call. Assigning to @kernel team. Thank you for your report. 
Comment 2 Krzysztof Pawlik (RETIRED) gentoo-dev 2010-12-26 10:20:26 UTC
You can always just grab the kernel configuration from Debian package and build it yourself. I don't see the problem that you're trying to solve by requesting this ebuild (and in fact I can see a lot of problems that can arose due to it).

If you want to live on the extreme end of things: `make allmodconfig'.
Comment 3 dE 2010-12-26 11:08:17 UTC
(In reply to comment #1)
> For the years I remember, the "gentoo way" is, users, to build their own kernel
> on their own (either using genkernel or pure/patched sources). Theoritically if
> someone wants to take a working configuration, he/she can use the kernel
> configuration of our livecds. Yes, I know that sometimes building your own
> kernel is frustrating (especially if someone is not an experienced linux/gentoo
> user) but using a debian kernel won't be a panacea in such cases. I'm also
> afraid that even an attempt to make an ebuild won't be as easy as you might
> think. The user will also have again to find which modules to probe for his/her
> hardware which isn't much different from building his/her own kernel. Last but
> not least, what every distro offers at the end is the "linux kernel", the
> difference is that our kernel comes with do-it-yourself instructions. I would
> resolve this as CANTFIX but it's not my call. Assigning to @kernel team. Thank
> you for your report. 
> 

Udev does the module loading. Currently I'm doing this cause my configured kernel does not (for some reason) churn enough FPS (resolution pending).

I can make the ebuild though.
Comment 4 dE 2010-12-26 11:30:33 UTC
Maybe this could be in some overlay.
Comment 5 Anthony Basile gentoo-dev 2010-12-26 16:05:08 UTC
(In reply to comment #2)
> You can always just grab the kernel configuration from Debian package and build
> it yourself. I don't see the problem that you're trying to solve by requesting
> this ebuild (and in fact I can see a lot of problems that can arose due to it).
> 
> If you want to live on the extreme end of things: `make allmodconfig'.
> 

1) This may not be sufficient.  They may not apply the same patches as we do.
2) This may not be desireable.  The patches they apply may break some userland.
3) The better approach would be for us to precompile kernels for our users.  Its more work, but then we could have control over the userland-kernel interactions.

Comment 6 Krzysztof Pawlik (RETIRED) gentoo-dev 2010-12-26 16:13:27 UTC
(In reply to comment #5)
> (In reply to comment #2)
> > You can always just grab the kernel configuration from Debian package and build
> > it yourself. I don't see the problem that you're trying to solve by requesting
> > this ebuild (and in fact I can see a lot of problems that can arose due to it).
> > 
> > If you want to live on the extreme end of things: `make allmodconfig'.
> > 
> 
> 1) This may not be sufficient.  They may not apply the same patches as we do.

Then provide {debian,centos,opensuse,whatever}-sources? Along with some ready-to-use configs?

> 2) This may not be desireable.  The patches they apply may break some userland.

This situation is possible with any kernel, be it patched or not.

> 3) The better approach would be for us to precompile kernels for our users. 
> Its more work, but then we could have control over the userland-kernel
> interactions.

I'm still against the idea of shipping around binary blobs of kernels. Think of all those possibilities: arches, kernel flavors. That looks like a quite big matrix to me: gentoo-sources has 10 arch keywords and `ll /usr/portage/sys-kernel/ | grep -- -sources | wc -l' shows 17 (including not interesting things like xbox-sources).

So we would end up supporting a little, tiny subset of users who are lucky enough that the binary blob provided by us works for them and matches what they need.
Comment 7 dE 2010-12-27 01:45:14 UTC
(In reply to comment #6)
> (In reply to comment #5)
> > (In reply to comment #2)
> > > You can always just grab the kernel configuration from Debian package and build
> > > it yourself. I don't see the problem that you're trying to solve by requesting
> > > this ebuild (and in fact I can see a lot of problems that can arose due to it).
> > > 
> > > If you want to live on the extreme end of things: `make allmodconfig'.
> > > 
> > 
> > 1) This may not be sufficient.  They may not apply the same patches as we do.
> 
> Then provide {debian,centos,opensuse,whatever}-sources? Along with some
> ready-to-use configs?
> 
I think this's a good idea... I support this instead of the binaries.

> > 2) This may not be desireable.  The patches they apply may break some userland.
> 
> This situation is possible with any kernel, be it patched or not.
> 
> > 3) The better approach would be for us to precompile kernels for our users. 
> > Its more work, but then we could have control over the userland-kernel
> > interactions.
> 
> I'm still against the idea of shipping around binary blobs of kernels. Think of
> all those possibilities: arches, kernel flavors. That looks like a quite big
> matrix to me: gentoo-sources has 10 arch keywords and `ll
> /usr/portage/sys-kernel/ | grep -- -sources | wc -l' shows 17 (including not
> interesting things like xbox-sources).
> 
> So we would end up supporting a little, tiny subset of users who are lucky
> enough that the binary blob provided by us works for them and matches what they
> need.
> 
Comment 8 dE 2010-12-31 06:35:37 UTC
Created attachment 258480 [details]
Sorry for the bad quality. If I improve it, I will volenteer to mainain these sources.
Comment 9 Krzysztof Pawlik (RETIRED) gentoo-dev 2010-12-31 10:19:42 UTC
dE: Could you please open a new bug about debian-sources? Also please take a look at already existing ebuilds for kernel sources and base your new ebuild on them.
Comment 10 dE 2010-12-31 12:27:21 UTC
Considered.
Comment 11 Chí-Thanh Christopher Nguyễn gentoo-dev 2010-12-31 19:01:46 UTC
Reopening for proper assignment.
Comment 12 Krzysztof Pawlik (RETIRED) gentoo-dev 2010-12-31 19:04:19 UTC
chithanh: This one stays as WONTFIX - we will NOT be adding precompiled kernels to the tree. We will add sources (along with configs) from other distributions however.